This thread is for discussion of the series "Elfen Lied". Please post comments, worksafe images and general triva. For those who have seen the series before, please refrain from posting spoilers until the relevant episode has been shown; we don't want to spoil it for the others now do we?

First order of business, a naked 14 year old dismembering people left right and centre. Is this art, or a simply an attempt to shock to audience?

I'm glad you actually posted an kind of opinion dude, you never do usually! Do it more, we need more activity here. Let's see...

I think while I did hush Kenny for laughing a lot at the start I do see why she did so - there is simply no real way to make such an opening act be too serious since we have no empathy with any of the characters yet. We have to make large assumptions about what is going on in a short space of time, and there is seemingly a lot of unnecessary violence because of that - even if the institution is "evil" or whatever, there is obviously someone letting the girl out on purpose and the guards don't exactly seem like the brightest sparks in the book but why bother killing them if they pose no threat? (She arbitrarily doesn't kill some of them too!).

What makes it more comical is because of the excessive violence the executive DOESN'T get killed, which, like the "Don't shoot the escape pod, there are no life signs" in Star Wars, leads to a scene which in retrospect just makes no sense what so ever and if she had killed him the plot would simply not be able to continue. That retrospect comes a few scenes later when he orders the girl to be shot with a sniper bullet (bizarrely waiting until she's just at the edge of the water AND not having more then one sniper too! Also they decided to not do this before I guess despite using machine guns on her earlier). It's a tad bizarre from something which seems to be leading up to more worthwhile things - there was no reason for the executive to be there in person except, apparently, the security office had this other dude letting her go so I guess he couldn't be there giving orders, or something.

Do we even know she is 14 anyway? In any case, the violence doesn't apparently make much sense mainly because she simply doesn't kill everyone especially the executive. It's partially comical the way the guards die too, looking back, but probably more so because it is quite an absurd way to kill them, heh.

Moving from that to a odd homeless girl thing is obviously not going to end well (cue incoming choppers of armed troops), but is much better done, although the amnesia element is pretty overused and frankly, there is no way you'd take some random naked person at the beach anywhere but the nearest hospital, but we'll leave that just to the plot machine again.

I have some hopes from what I already have read up on the series that it'll raise some interesting points, we'll see. Perhaps there will be slightly more justified violence in the future.

Andrew wrote:

QUOTE:
I'm glad you actually posted an kind of opinion dude, you never do usually! Do it more, we need more activity here. Let's see...
<snip>

Do we even know she is 14 anyway?

Weeeeeelll, that infallible tome of knowledge wikipedia give her age as "around 18", so I will conceed that point. I was going by Bando (a.k.a Mr Smack-women-who-surprise-him) commenting that she was a minor, not sure where I got 14 from, now I think about it

Anyway, I don't have an opinion of series yet, I was playing devil's advocate in hope of stirring up some conversations. I don't judge any anime until 5 episodes in.

That's almost half the series, wow, well, I guess we'll see what you think in 4 weeks?

Hehe..the first episode was funny.

Sorry, I dont mean to be loud (what with half-deafness I can't help not hearing my own volume), but seeing a girl walk up to people and their heads falling off, I don't have sympathy for these nameless characters, it's funny! I quite like a bit of violence.

I'll control myself in future.

This series is interesting me though. Looking forward to the plot of this one unfolding.

I'm tending to agree with Richard here, the absurdity of constant "contrived coincidences and convenient stupidity" to move the plot along was just begging to be put down. At least it was short, I don't know how they could have drawn it out much longer without introducing more idiocy.

Violence and sex can be tastefully done (or have a point), not so much here; it was a bit bare faced about being extreme with little or no point (as with my original comment the violence does get VERY comical, constantly so!). People died rather arbitrarily, plot information fell into certain characters laps who simply don't tell anyone else, plot holes bigger then a big hole empty of plot appear one after another just to be ignored later...the ending comes out of nowhere too (who was that damn guy with glasses real daughter? wait...f, I don't care! dumb b brought it on himself).

When the main cast barely know the superpowers of the people they're interacting with, you've gotta start asking yourself just why...

While something like Tenjho Tenge (which I still won't directly comment on!) can be perhaps let off for having idiots in it since it focuses on fighting and relationships, it doesn't fit here since it tries the mystery card too hard. Characters act out of character constantly despite having very little character to start with; people run off constantly only to run back only to run off. The flashbacks provide no real insight into what the creatures actually are (or how they made more of them), or what on earth the shadowy organisation is in the first place. This is less mysterious and more just stupid, especially what causes Lucy to go and kill things...bugger me they're like 10 or something and she's getting jealous of his cousin! How on earth does she even know this crap?

Infuriating since it could have been a somewhat interesting take on "mad science" and taking over the world plots with experiments on some new monster or something. I still don't understand any of the bad guy's motivations, being completely and utterly bemusing throughout by their decisions and the decisions by the protagonists.

Perhaps everyone was insane...mmm

With no proper ending (seriously trying to do stupid mystery at the end is bemusing...clock, bad guy with horns and all, fuck no I don't want sequel material shoehorned into a climax!), and it was noted to me there was a manga, which we discussed likely at least had a different ending or continuation, but I can't see how it'd salvage the early stuff.

I will give it that there was (sometimes very unintentional) funny moments, some passable relationship stuff, some slightly interesting fights, and at least it started with a hint of mystery and plot, only to ruin it half way through the first episode as per Richards description. The invisible hand things was seemingly the only thing taken half seriously, if only randomly.

(I will say that Richard perhaps misunderstands how cousins can date; if they are non-paternal cousins it'd be two different families (you never do learn their family names though!) - I'm also surprised it was a 5/10, I'd go lower...since I usually ignore animation quality which in this case was rather high, and the acting wasn't terrible).

Subpar overall, sadly! I just hoped it would pick up towards the end, and it decidedly didn't. However it was worth somewhat the time to watch it considering the length.

You make a lot of good points there Andrew, but I'm not going to answer all of them out respect for the people who actually enjoyed the series. In writing the review I think I said all I needed to say. However there's two things I want to clear up.

Andrew wrote:

QUOTE:

(I will say that Richard perhaps misunderstands how cousins can date; if they are non-paternal cousins it'd be two different families (you never do learn their family names though!) - I'm also surprised it was a 5/10, I'd go lower...since I usually ignore animation quality which in this case was rather high, and the acting wasn't terrible).

As I mentioned to you last night, I called it "taboo, because in most societies marrying your cousin would raise and eyebrow, and a "grey area", as there doesn't seem to be a universal consenus on this issue. Some countries flat out ban cousin marriage, some don't, and america can't make up its mind as some states do ban it. The rights and wrong of this practice is outside the remit of my review and this forum for that matter.

As for 5/10, I will now state my marking scheme.

10/10: The hypothetical perfect anime.

9/10: Absolute classic, reccomended for absolutely anyone, including non-anime fans.

8/10: Minor or genre classic. Mandatory watching for fans of that type of anime, or really good anime just stops short true excellence.

7/10: Above average - good. A solid anime, but a good distance from must see territory. Also the maximum I would give to an anime thats starts well, but ends very badly, or vice versa.

6/10: Average/watchable. The low end of anime enjoyable anime, entertaining, but flawed and disposable,

5/10: Average/poor. The key point where the bad outweighs the good, but there's still something to enjoy.

4/10: Bad, plain bad. Usually incidates a general failure in all aspects of the anime bar one.

3/10: Awful. No redeeming features.

2/10: Unspeakably bad. So bad it can't even be watched for humour value.

1/10: Crime against the veiwing public.

You said I did 3 f's at Namsoc, so I'm annoyed because I only used two, honestly, at least get that correct, hahaha! Perfectly valid to swear on a forum isn't it? If not, I'll tone it down and you'll get a similar amount of damn's and bugger's instead; of course since no one reads this no one will tell me I did wrong (and I'd have not known if you hadn't pointed it out).

If you don't want to state your opinions despite posting a review, that's your own prerogative; seems bemusing to me to not discuss it further, considering your torrent of abuse you did in your own review, and the fact no one reads these forums anyway, ho ho!

I don't need a list of numbers with reasons next to them, because I take more away from your own reviews tone and text body then I do from a rating; in this case decidedly and absolutely negative; I guessed you'd score it lower but was surprised you said it was average at the end. I like picking apart these inconsistencies because perhaps it means the reviewer hasn't properly put out what they meant to say in the text.

I've already stated that "cousins marrying" is silly when in-laws are considered (cousins-in-law are not blood related of course; the "taboo" obviously only applies to blood related ones, we're ALL technically distant cousins-in-law after all by definition since it is a broad term and you go back far enough...), but whatever, there is a valid explanation, but it isn't very clear and I wouldn't put money on defending it much; it factors into it so little it is silly to say much more on it - perhaps odd how they were not just childhood friends, but who knows...

Andrew, the tone of your messages are rather provocative, its almost as if you are trying to bait me. The way I see it there's little for us to further discuss, we both agree on the key points, and the only points of disagreement are trivial. I've said all I need to say, you've said all you need to say, but it does seem that you are trying to drag this out. Now, out of respect for the people who actually enjoyed the series, I am not saying any more on it, that is what the review if for. If you really, really, really, need to debate this with someone, please find someone else.

I'm pretty speechless.

I've sent you a PM since my words here wouldn't make much sense. There is little point in dragging this out here.